Street Fighter IV

[ScaryGary]

it's finally here and it is bad-fucking-ass. once again, Capcom deliver. I got the Collector's Edition (PS3) today. nice little package; but I can't seem to get myself away from what matters most, the actual game. omfg. I've been a major fan of SFIII:3rd Strike for a number of years now. in a way, it hurts me to say, that SFIV has outdone it. but that's not a bad thing, whatsoever. it really had alot to outbest, and that it certainly does. I've never really cared for SFII, so of course I was dissapointed to hear that SFIV would focus once again on it's characters, rather than SFIII's; but this has actually brought me to respect each and everyone of them.

now I'm going to leave the Guilty Gear XX series out of this (as it's essentially a totally different type of fighter): Street Fighter IV is the greatest fighting game of all time, without a doubt. the mechanics to this game just feels so...right. it's unbelievable. while previous Street Fighters carried the feel of mindless 'karate' games, Street Fighter IV feels more like boxing, with more of a 'twist' of various other fighting styles. it's very pleasing. every single character feels unique. unlike other SF games, there is a VERY distinguishable difference between characters as closely alike as Ken and Ryo, even.

now if you're playing this in SD, you'll get the message and I'm sure you'll have just as good a time with it; but as with most other games, you won't get the full experience. this game was clearly intended for HD. it is BEAUTIFUL.

I'd also like to note, if you have the HDD space, be sure to install this. me and a friend were playing this side by side. me on my PS3. him on his 360. we had eventually synced by finishing matches at the same time, and I was rather frustrated to notice that, inbetween matches, it took nearly twice as long to load on PS3; but was much happier to realize there was an 'optional install' option under the 'options' menu. be sure to do this on either version, as it's rather rewardable; making up for what minor flaws of the individual consoles might effect the game, of which both versions are rather identicle to either. I could even swear that after install, it even looked better.

anyhow, I'd really hope SNK study this game well before releasing KOFXII (of which I also anticipate). but it's safe to say SFIV will be the game all series will build off, for a while to come.

I urge you all to play this.

[ObsidianZ]

I still need to pick up my copy.

I'm super hyped for Fei Long and Gen. I'm so glad they put them in the home versions. I'm going to be learning C.Viper too.

Hey scarygary, are you playing SF2 HDR? What's your PSN?

Or just add me...ObsidianZ


*ObZ

[ScaryGary]

I was hoping C Viper's control style would be similar to Lori from KOF; and I still do while playing as her; so she's a little hard for me to really play as.

my favorite newcomer is definatly Abel, though. he almost makes up for SFIV's lack of Alex (DLC, plz). I was hoping his style would be sort of a cross between Alex and Clark Steel (various KOF's), and thankfully, it basically is. he's a breeze to catch onto if you're familiar much familiar with either of them.

but no, I don't have SSFIITHDR; as I mentioned, I've never really cared for SFII much. my PSN is SoundJam, by the way.

[ObsidianZ]

Does Abel still have his infinite or did they fix that :P.

I remember seeing a vid a couple months back.


*ObZ

[Trueborn]

So far, out of 107 xbox live ranked matches, I've won 91. As, that's right, fucking Guile. Not Ken. Not Akuma. Not Ryu.

Guile.

I'm so glad this game is finally in the U.S.

[Cegstar]

So far, out of 107 xbox live ranked matches, I've won 91. As, that's right, fucking Guile. Not Ken. Not Akuma. Not Ryu.

Guile.

I'm so glad this game is finally in the U.S.

If you want, add me (same name as here).

I won't be Ken/Ryu. Honest. I'm sick of facing them. Of my last 25 online fights, they've ALL been Ken.

I'm only playing unranked for now, though.

[ScaryGary]

Trueborn, it's been out in the US for a while now, on arcade. about just as long as it had been in Japan. it's just that it's cabinet is hard to come by, as it costs a fucking shit load. being released on console is just basically considered it's release, as you won't have to drive three states away to play it anymore. it's nice to see a Guile user, anyhow. I favor Remy (from SFIII) alot, myself. they're very similar.

ObsidianZ: I'm not sure about Abel's infinite. though I'd imagine if it were a glitch, they likely patched it.

[P_R_Deltoid]

It's too bad they just redelivered the last game. I don't dislike fighters, but Jesus Christ, it's getting as much hype as Madden.

[Haiti's Space Agency]

There's hype for Madden?

[P_R_Deltoid]

There's hype for Madden?


Surprising, eh? Considering it's the same game every year (Hey, that reminds me of Street Fighter.)

[ScaryGary]

P_R_Deltoid, you're an idiot. this is the first Street Fighter game in over ten years, chronology-wise. yes, we realize SFII has been re-released several, several times; and even us fighter die-hards are highly annoyed by that. We all loved SFIII more, anyway; of which was re-released only twice. each with enough new characters and rebalances to make it worth buying over again. unlike sports games, where it's just the latest roster. being in the DLC-age, it's highly unlikely we'll be chipping out another $60 on the next 'version' of SFIV. anyhow, each chronological Street Fighter (or Capcom fighter, alltogether) are different in their own ways. yes, you still punch and kick in SFIV like you did in the others. but theres plenty more to fighters than just that. this being, theres plenty reason in SFIV to move on from SFIII. unless you only played to show off your mad parry skills, of course.

[dij314]

How similar is this game to the older SF games? I had a thing for the PS2 called 'Street Fighter Alpha Anthology' with the 2D (obv) SF Alpha games and I didn't like them a ton, but SF4 looks pretty sick. I'm considering trying it out.

[ScaryGary]

SFIV feels like a perfect hybrid between SFII and SFIII, really. save for no super jump or parry system from SFIII's behalf. as a fighter, it feels perfect. seriously. it's that good. if the latest batch of thrown together and tossed out Mortal Kombat games didn't look stupid enough, SFIV was the final blow.

SFIV is also very easy to pick up on. especially if you're into fighters. if you couldn't pull of Special or Super attacks in the previous SF games, SFIV will still call for some practice, on your behalf. because it still has that sense of depth to it. I'd like to recommend checking out SFIII:3rd Strike to you first (Street Fighter Anniversary Collectin), but as of now, there is no better place to start (or get back in) than SFIV.

[33% God]

Isn't Street Fighter 4 just the older games with a new,3D look to it?

This is what i've always been lead to believe by the way people talk about it and all the early talk i've heard.

[Cegstar]

Isn't Street Fighter 4 just the older games with a new,3D look to it?

This is what i've always been lead to believe by the way people talk about it and all the early talk i've heard.

Pretty much, which is great. I loved SF2, but SF3 felt fast and awkward.
This is pretty much an enhanced SF2, enhanced graphically and has very smooth gameplay.

[ObsidianZ]

First impressions after about an hour of play:

Moves are laaaggy. Somehow they made fireballs even more useless than in SF3.

And jumping is so wonky. For some reason it feels very obvious that you're leaping 12 feet in the air in a split second. Feels wrong. Just me nitpicking.


EDIT: Some more thoughts:

Ultras need to be removed. I knew they were a bad idea from the start. Giving a weak player a comeback move just punishes the other player for doing well. It's been tried before in an older less known game, and it failed. Yes, a good player can build up their revenge meter with saving moves. Aside from that, Ultras have very little strategic value. They'd be better off taking them out and having saving moves add to your normal super bar. Which brings me to my next point:

Normal Supers are completely useless. You'll never use them. For one thing, it takes forever to build up bar. They're much weaker than Ultras. Ultras come out much more frequently than Supers, which makes no intuitive sense. There are so many other better uses for bar than to waste a whole four stocks on a weak super.

C.Viper, the character I wanted to learn, is complete shit-tier :mad:. Zero anti-air, slow pokes, low damage output, weak punishes, and takes damage like a baby. The only thing she has going for her are her jump cancel off of normals, which is really only somewhat good for escape, and 50/50 oki mixups with her flame kick. The funny thing is, I'm still beating about 75% of the online people I meet and I've just started playing today. The amount of Akuma/Ken scrubs is staggering.

Inputs have to be spot on, much like SF2. Surprising since SF3 was much more lenient.

I'm just praying that things will get better once I unlock Fei Long and Gen.

*sigh* So when's BlazBlue coming out?


*ObZ

[Cegstar]

Ultras need to be removed. I knew they were a bad idea from the start. Giving a weak player a comeback move just punishes the other player for doing well. It's been tried before in an older less known game, and it failed. Yes, a good player can build up their revenge meter with saving moves. Aside from that, Ultras have very little strategic value. They'd be better off taking them out and having saving moves add to your normal super bar. Which brings me to my next point:

*ObZ

I agree the revenge meter.

My recent tactic for winning : Exchange punch for punch, fireball for fireball, or whatever. Your opponent will block (likely) every time. You should only block 1/3 times. This will cause both meters to go up. Do two ultra specials, and you win.

[Fetus-Smasher]

This street fighter is made well. I'm very good at street fighter SVC chaos, so I'm all about the timing. Sf4 is hard to gauge the milliseconds that you begin your move. I like this game.

[Cegstar]

This street fighter is made well. I'm very good at street fighter SVC chaos, so I'm all about the timing. Sf4 is hard to gauge the milliseconds that you begin your move. I like this game.

I don't find timing to be a bother at all. You can be literally knocked on the ground with a full meter, and do the combo as you're getting up and still pulli t off.

[ScaryGary]

So you don't like it, ObsidianZ?

you do have a point with the Ultra system. at times I find myself intentionally taking damage just to let the meter build (as far as I know, it only builds through damage taken. making anyone who claims to have gotten a Perfect w/ Ultra Finish a bullshitter). the 'turn around' concept is a little pointless, but it still makes sense, really. (it does seem familiar, though: was it Samurai Shodown that had something like this?). Ultras can do SERIOUS damage (about half a bar, on full meter.); I think it would have been more right for basic Supers to do the more damage, with Ultras being more of the quarter-bar damage dealing desperation attack. nonetheless, I find it all works together really well, and makes for some interesting fights. SFIV is very well balanced, as well as polished. aside from asking for a few characters from 3rd Strike, I couldn't ask for anything else from SFIV.

and BlazBlue, omfg. BlazBlue is what I'm TRUELY waiting for. I cannot describe my anticipation for that game. but as I've said with it's spiritual precursor, Guilty Gear: I have to leave it out of this. two totally seperate things (BlazBlue will be atleast 10x faster, more polished, more beautiful and more over-all extremely rad than any SF could ever be.). why isn't there an SFvsGG? because that would make SF a pitiful joke. KOFXII on the other hand, excited for that?

[ScaryGary]

Isn't Street Fighter 4 just the older games with a new,3D look to it?

This is what i've always been lead to believe by the way people talk about it and all the early talk i've heard.

well, as is the case with any revived series, yeah. but it's not like...'the same thing yet again'. the other day on my lunch break I walked over to the record store (I work in a mall) and bumped into a guy I knew who (along with a friend of mine) is a projectionist at the local theatre here. he was carrying a Gamestop bag, so I asked him what he got: turned out to be the latest Hulk game :facepalm:. so of course I asked him why didn't he get SFIV and he was like "cause it looks like the old one". "?!?!1/?!?1/?!" was my response. I get offended by shit like this. I get offended by idiots who see cartoony 2D things and assume it's 20 years behind. 2D and cartoonish graphics will never go away folks. they're only getting better. look at Okami. look at MadWorld. the Bodukai Tenkaichi series. for the most part these are 3D games, anyhow. sometimes they just lack depth (perception-wise). sometimes they're just drawn over for artistic reason (which takes hella loads of effort. never think games like this are slapped together. they take A LOT of effort). ugh... :rant:

and so on...

[33% God]

He was like "cause it looks like the old one". "?!?!1/?!?1/?!" was my response. I get offended by shit like this.

Well...didn't you people just say it's almost identical in the game play to the old games?

[ScaryGary]

no offense to you by the way, 33%. I was refering more to whoever told you this, than I was you. yes, if you're well familiar with any previous SF, you should fair fine from the start in this one. I'm not saying you'll be a pro. but you've got the basics down, already. you won't have to aquire much at all, unless of course, it's been years since you've played.

as with many games with a sequel, say; from Resident Evil 4 to 5: if you did good in that, once you pick up on the new stuff and maybe the slight change in controls, you should still have it down pretty well.

'it feels like the older games' in a good way, rather. it's definatly a completely fresh experience.

[ObsidianZ]

So you don't like it, ObsidianZ?

Not that I don't like it, I'm just a little disapointed. I think it was a mistake to borrow so much from SF2. It's like step backwards from SF3. The mechanics are really showing their age.

What baffles me is how HD Remix and SF4 diverged. HDR fixed alot of things, including simplifying the unnecessarily complex move inputs. No more 360's, TK's, or triple punches/kicks. SF4 inputs haven't change at all. (except for Sagat's Tiger Knee which is now a DP motion....this doesn't make sense because Fei Long's flying kick move is still a TK...the only TK move in the game. Inconsistencyyyyy...).

In my mind SF4 and 3s appeal to two completely different audiences. I guess I was just spoiled by 3s and other faster, more technical fighters, which I know isn't really fair to SF4.

I'm only really interested in seeing how far Saving Cancels will go. Right now I've only seen them used defensively, most people ignore the Saving system completely. They're definitely not as useful as GG FRC/RC's, but I'm still hoping some crazy combos will be discovered.

What characters are you guys running? I'm still using CViper. She's a scrub killer, but very little chance against a proper player. I main Fei Long even though his damage has been severely reduced. He did get a new command grab, so I'm still playing around with that. Sakura is very promising as well. Good rushdown and quick stun. I'll learn her eventually as well.

*ObZ

[Cegstar]

What characters are you guys running? I'm still using CViper. She's a scrub killer, but very little chance against a proper player. I main Fei Long even though his damage has been severely reduced. He did get a new command grab, so I'm still playing around with that. Sakura is very promising as well. Good rushdown and quick stun. I'll learn her eventually as well.

*ObZ

I use Sagat a lot of the time. I also use C. Viper and Balrog. If someone (like the last player) I fought against uses Ken numerous times (this guy used no one but Ken ten times in a row), I use Akuma or Ryu.

[ScaryGary]

ObsidianZ: I've always seen it as SFII and SFIII appealing to seperate audiences. I suppose SFIV would appeal to the SFII ones alot, because their characters are back and the mechanics are simple again: but I find SFIV to have something for SFII and SFIII fans alike. after years of playing 3rd Strike it sucked to hear of SFIV going back to still indepth, but simplified; yet, it still hurts me to say that SFIV is probably the better title. it took 3 releases to perfect SFIII: SFIV was done in one. it's all DLC from here; but if Capcom want to through in some System Direction settings, that would be so awesome.

as far as characters: SFIV has really gotten me to respect Bison quite a bit, so I've been using the hell out of him. as well as Abel.

on a side note: I played some online matches the other day and quite honestly, I got my ass whipped (fuckin' cheap-ass repetitive Ken users!).

[ObsidianZ]

Ken is especially scrub-friendly in SF2/4. The game is so turtle-friendly.

A full screen fireball. There's no way to air block/counter so you're always going to eat flaming DP's. Hurricane Kicks have almost instant recovery so they're always safe on block and almost always safe even on whiff. Block stun on sweep is long enough to allow repeated jump-in RH > sweep tactics. When in doubt, flaming DP. It will beat everything.

When playing scrubby Kens, best to use a good rushdown character to keep them in the corner. Charge characters will lose to fireball and sweep spamming.

CViper is good. Super jump to get in on fireballs. After a knockdown, 3 options: TK LK flame kick overhead, meaty crouching MK > lightning punch, or TK HK flame kick to cross up and throw. Or you can bait out a flaming DP reversal attempt and punish.

Or Fei Long. Flying kicks over the fireballs and push into the corner. Fei Long's corner game is his only strong point. Rekka Ken pokes, low LK and MP pokes, mix it up with some overhead flying kicks or forward MK tick (overhead) to throw. For some reason they reduced the range of his crouching MP and slowed down his crouching HP. Why they needed to nerf the best pokes on a subpar character, I will never know.

ITT: Tactics to rape those motherfucking Ken players :mad:.

Other annoying characters: Akuma air fireball spammers and Bison psycho crusher spammers. At least Bison doesn't get a free massive damage throw after a blocked psycho crusher this time around. Seriously annoying in SF2.


*ObZ

[Cegstar]

K
ITT: Tactics to rape those motherfucking Ken players :mad:.


*ObZ

I got called a cheater because I beat a Ken-player with Zangief. It's also fun to kick them out of the air using Dhalsim.

I've yet to fight someone who used M. Bison.

[Haiti's Space Agency]

Ken is especially scrub-friendly in SF2/4. The game is so turtle-friendly.

A full screen fireball. There's no way to air block/counter so you're always going to eat flaming DP's. Hurricane Kicks have almost instant recovery so they're always safe on block and almost always safe even on whiff. Block stun on sweep is long enough to allow repeated jump-in RH > sweep tactics. When in doubt, flaming DP. It will beat everything.

When playing scrubby Kens, best to use a good rushdown character to keep them in the corner. Charge characters will lose to fireball and sweep spamming.

CViper is good. Super jump to get in on fireballs. After a knockdown, 3 options: TK LK flame kick overhead, meaty crouching MK > lightning punch, or TK HK flame kick to cross up and throw. Or you can bait out a flaming DP reversal attempt and punish.

Or Fei Long. Flying kicks over the fireballs and push into the corner. Fei Long's corner game is his only strong point. Rekka Ken pokes, low LK and MP pokes, mix it up with some overhead flying kicks or forward MK tick (overhead) to throw. For some reason they reduced the range of his crouching MP and slowed down his crouching HP. Why they needed to nerf the best pokes on a subpar character, I will never know.

ITT: Tactics to rape those motherfucking Ken players :mad:.

Other annoying characters: Akuma air fireball spammers and Bison psycho crusher spammers. At least Bison doesn't get a free massive damage throw after a blocked psycho crusher this time around. Seriously annoying in SF2.


*ObZ

No idea what the fuck your talking about.

[Trueborn]

Ken players don't scare me in the least. I've fought enough of them to know exactly how to end them no matter what tactics they try to pull. I simply thought it was humorous at first when every single opponent picked him; that's changed because I think everyone figured out that everyone else was also playing as Ken. When it happens now, I'll sometimes drop out before the fight even starts because it's boring fighting against the same person over and over. I'm not so much in to battle points that I'll play a game that bores me.

I play as Guile almost exclusively. I don't pick my character based on whoever my opponent picks, even though I know for a fact that a lot of my opponents have. I move straight to Guile and mash the A button to get stuff started. If my opponent is waiting to see who I pick, this is normally the point where they go directly to Zangief only to get their ass handed to them. "Here, you dropped this."

The toughest fight I've had *outside of Japan* was actually an in-person competition against Blanka in a GameStop tournament. It was the semi-finals, too. I didn't feel too bad losing the bracket because the guy I fought went on to win the whole thing.

[ObsidianZ]

Heh I love using 'Gief. Green fists and spinning through fireballs, constant grabs and throws, I can just imagine their :mad: faces when I get near perfects.

No idea what the fuck your talking about.

I can explain everything if you want, alex :cool:.

That goes for everyone else too, I've got yeeears of experience with several different fighters. The player community for fighting games is much more important and significant than other gaming communities so I help whenever I can.


*ObZ

[Haiti's Space Agency]

Heh I love using 'Gief. Green fists and spinning through fireballs, constant grabs and throws, I can just imagine their :mad: faces when I get near perfects.



I can explain everything if you want, alex :cool:.

That goes for everyone else too, I've got yeeears of experience with several different fighters. The player community for fighting games is much more important and significant than other gaming communities so I help whenever I can.


*ObZ

What do you mean when you say TK, LK, and MK?

[ObsidianZ]

LK = light kick
MK = medium kick

TK is going to take a lot more explaining. It stands for "Tiger Knee". In SF2, Sagat's Tiger Knee move required a special movement. Down, downforward, forward, upforward. So out of the 8 directions on the joystick, you're rolling through 4/8 directions.

Some moves can be done in the air. Like CViper's flaming kick, she can do it on the ground or in the air. Usually, the air versions of moves like these hit faster and recover faster than the ground versions. The TK technique is a way to use the air versions while standing on the ground.

The normal movement for the flaming kick is down, downback, back + kick (quarter circle back + kick, QCB + kick).

If you do the TK movement (down, downback, back, upback + kick), you get the QCB required for the flaming kick move, plus the upback portion counts as a jump. In effect, you perform an air flaming kick with all its benefits from a standing position on the ground.

TK'ing air moves is very useful technique to learn, and it comes in handy for many other fighting games too.


*ObZ

[Haiti's Space Agency]

LK = light kick
MK = medium kick

TK is going to take a lot more explaining. It stands for "Tiger Knee". In SF2, Sagat's Tiger Knee move required a special movement. Down, downforward, forward, upforward. So out of the 8 directions on the joystick, you're rolling through 4/8 directions.

Some moves can be done in the air. Like CViper's flaming kick, she can do it on the ground or in the air. Usually, the air versions of moves like these hit faster and recover faster than the ground versions. The TK technique is a way to use the air versions while standing on the ground.

The normal movement for the flaming kick is down, downback, back + kick (quarter circle back + kick, QCB + kick).

If you do the TK movement (down, downback, back, upback + kick), you get the QCB required for the flaming kick move, plus the upback portion counts as a jump. In effect, you perform an air flaming kick with all its benefits from a standing position on the ground.

TK'ing air moves is very useful technique to learn, and it comes in handy for many other fighting games too.


*ObZ
So TK is a glitch?

[ObsidianZ]

Not at all. It's just the way the game interprets the motions.

*ObZ

[Haiti's Space Agency]

Not at all. It's just the way the game interprets the motions.

*ObZ

What are the benefits of doing an air attack on the ground?

[ObsidianZ]

Let me clarify: When TKing, you're still jumping. You're not really doing the air move on the ground per se. It's like you jump and then immediately perform the move. So it's not a glitch, maybe a bit of an exploit, but it's well known, it's found in different games, and the programmers have obviously decided to leave it in.

Air versions of moves hit faster and recover faster. They also hit high so they can't be blocked while crouching.


*ObZ

[Haiti's Space Agency]

Let me clarify: When TKing, you're still jumping. You're not really doing the air move on the ground per se. It's like you jump and then immediately perform the move. So it's not a glitch, maybe a bit of an exploit, but it's well known, it's found in different games, and the programmers have obviously decided to leave it in.

Air versions of moves hit faster and recover faster. They also hit high so they can't be blocked while crouching.


*ObZ
I see. Are you good at fighting games?

[ScaryGary]

The player community for fighting games is much more important and significant than other gaming communities so I help whenever I can.

this is very true. I've played in fighting tournaments and FPS tournaments side-by-side (switching back and forth inbetween matches) and the people at fighting tournaments are the most friendly and interactive gamers you'll ever meet. the FPS people talk shit, get pissed off when they're losing or outright lose. mainly a bunch of scener kids who think they're the shit, really. fighting tournaments are like...true nerds and/or asian kids (I'm neither. seriously); most of either of which are college students. good people. I mean, these guys bring their own custom-made joystick pads. these dudes are fuckin' serious, man. they'll whip your fuckin' ass and then shake your hand. but again, good people. great environment. great times.

[ObsidianZ]

Hey Vorpal, since you play a charge character, do you know if charge partitioning is possible in SF4?

I'm also wondering about karas...

Both were glitches in SF3 but they weren't broken and actually added a good deal of depth to the game. I'm not sure if they would have fixed it in SF4.


*ObZ

[sdmf_from_hell]

say if i'm low on cash and im thinking about buying this game. I enjoyed and have fond memories or SFII on the original Gameboy as a young tacker but was never very good at it... Should i buy this game?

Judging by people already in this thread, i already know the answer. but its worth a shot.

Also is there any cool modes like on the Mega Drive (Genesis) version of SFII? (by which i mean bashing up cars etc in the 'story' mode)

I still hum Chun Li's theme to this day (in it's 4bit glory)

[Anima Mundi]

Finally played online today. BROKEN. AS. FUCK. I couldn't even stand it. I went back to TF2 in a matter of matches.

[ObsidianZ]

^Care to elabourate?

*ObZ

[ScaryGary]

the online is fine. just check the connection of the person you're playing. you can narrow your search by connection status, if you'd like.

[Trueborn]

Finally played online today. BROKEN. AS. FUCK. I couldn't even stand it. I went back to TF2 in a matter of matches.

That's odd.

Works perfectly for me.

[ObsidianZ]

I haven't had any problems, even when playing with people who have only 2 or 3 bars on the connection indicator. While I was torrenting.


*ObZ

[Cegstar]

Hey Vorpal, since you play a charge character, do you know if charge partitioning is possible in SF4?

I'm also wondering about karas...

Both were glitches in SF3 but they weren't broken and actually added a good deal of depth to the game. I'm not sure if they would have fixed it in SF4.


*ObZ

Can I ask what that is?

I noticed if knocked down with a charge character (I use blanka occasionally), you can start charging while on the ground and do an instant charge move when you get up... is that it?

[Dillinger22]

When it comes to fighting games i'm a complete noob, srsly

my most time spent on a fighting game was probably WWF attitude when I was about 10, and 90% of that was spent fucking about creating wrestlers

i've played a bit of tekken, a bit of MK etc, and i'm a complete button masher, don't really have a clue what i'm doing, i realise the depth of some fighting games and maybe thats what puts me off, it is intimidating

I do find them fascinating though, and the commnity itself especially
I have a few questions for you all

Best fighting game ever?
why?

what do you generally think of mortal combat?
tekken?
soul calibur?
dead or alive?

which game has the most hardcore fanbase?
which engine has the most depth?


buying a fighting game on 360 to properly get into for the first time, should i go for street fighter IV?
playing online is a big part of the appeal

[ObsidianZ]

Can I ask what that is?

I noticed if knocked down with a charge character (I use blanka occasionally), you can start charging while on the ground and do an instant charge move when you get up... is that it?

Nope, that's pretty standard :p. As long as you're holding the right directions, no matter what else you do it counts towards your "charge time". Protip: Always charge by using downback. It counts as charging for back-forward moves and for down-up moves.

Charge partitioning:

Let's take Guile for an example. Let's say it takes him 20 frames to charge up for a flash kick (this is an arbitrary number, I don't know the actual frame data). Normally, you would have to hold down or downback for the full 20 frames. Charge partitioning breaks this rule.

Example 1: You charge for 15 frames. Dash forward, quickly return the joystick to the down position and charge for the remaining 5 frames then flash kick. Basically, you dash in then flash kick, seemingly without having to charge as much.

Example 2: You charge for 30 frames. Dash forward, down-up-kick. Again, a flash kick off of a dash. You retain the charge you previously saved up, so you just have to do the motion without charging to get an instant flash kick.

(note: it doesn't have to be a forward dash. It can be a back dash, a simple step forward or back, or a jump. Jumps don't really count because by the time the jump is finished, you have a full charge anyways)

Alright this might seem really broken and really glitchy, and it is :p. The catch: it's very hard to actually pull off. In order to keep any charge time you may have already stored, you need to return the joystick to the charging position within a few frames (I believe it was 6 in SF3:3s). Considering that 3s was a 30fps game, this was very difficult but not impossible. SF4 is a 60fps game. Since charge partitioning is a glitch, they may have taken it out. If not, the timing will be that much more difficult.

You basically have to go from downback, forward forward (dash), downback in a fifth of a second. Alot has to do with the sensitivity and quality of the stick. Impossible on an American stick, possible on Japanese sticks.

So far I don't think charge partitioning is in the game. It's not completely confirmed.



HOWEVER: Kara throws are definitely in. Kara throwing basically increases the range of your basic throws. For example: Ryu's forward+MP, he takes a step forward and punches downwards. If you input the throw command (LP+LK) immediately after inputting f+MP, Ryu still moves forward, the punch is interrupted, and a throw comes out instead. This is not a cancel in the normal sense, I've always thought it was a real glitch. For some reason it's in the new game.


Aaaand since I'm sick of typing out "forward" and "downback" and all that garbage, I'm introducing the numpad notation to zoklet.

Look at your numpad. 5 is standing neutral, 1 is downback, 6 is forward, 9 is jumping forward, etc. So to perform a fireball: 236+P.


Next lesson....I dunno, what do you guys want to know about :D.


*ObZ

[ScaryGary]

Best fighting game ever?
why?

what do you generally think of mortal combat?
tekken?
soul calibur?
dead or alive?

which game has the most hardcore fanbase?
which engine has the most depth?


buying a fighting game on 360 to properly get into for the first time, should i go for street fighter IV?
playing online is a big part of the appeal

best 'Fist & Foot' fighter? yes. no doubt. but the greatest fighter ever, in my opinion and probably most other fighter enthusiasts, would be the Guilty Gear XX series. it's as fast, brutal, complex, beautiful, well balanced and over-all rad as a fighting game can possibly be. I honestly think the only thing that could potentially outbest it is it's upcoming spiritual sequel, BlazBlue: Calamity Trigger.

Mortal Kombat, over-all, is garbage, really. it's a dead exploided fad. the only people still buying into it are nostalgics. Killer Instinct stomped it. Tekken, I've never really cared for. I've always liked Soul Calibur a bit more. but 3D fighting games, alltogether, are button smashers. Dead or Alive, while always graphically great, is nothing but bouncing breasts.

as for your 'hardcore fanbase'/'engine' question. Guilty Gear XX. no doubt in my mind.

if you're looking to get into complex 2D-control style fighters, I would recommend:

Street Fighter III: 3rd Strike
Street Fighter IV
King of Fighters: NeoWave
Guilty Gear XX (#Reload, Midnight Carnival or Accent Core)
various SNK, Capcom or Capcom vs SNK titles. (CvS2, MvC2, Samurai Shodown, Fatal Fury, Darkstalkers, etc.) -- as far as fighters, you really can't go too wrong with Capcom or SNK. you could look into the Maximum Impact subseries of King of Fighters. the fighting engine is there, but over-all, they're rather bland.

[ObsidianZ]

When it comes to fighting games i'm a complete noob, srsly

my most time spent on a fighting game was probably WWF attitude when I was about 10, and 90% of that was spent fucking about creating wrestlers

i've played a bit of tekken, a bit of MK etc, and i'm a complete button masher, don't really have a clue what i'm doing, i realise the depth of some fighting games and maybe thats what puts me off, it is intimidating

I do find them fascinating though, and the commnity itself especially
I have a few questions for you all

Best fighting game ever?
why?

what do you generally think of mortal combat?
tekken?
soul calibur?
dead or alive?

which game has the most hardcore fanbase?
which engine has the most depth?


buying a fighting game on 360 to properly get into for the first time, should i go for street fighter IV?
playing online is a big part of the appeal

I will say this: The biggest barrier to fighting games is the high learning curve. There is a metric fuckton of information out there, not to mention the technical skill required to do half the stuff. It's taken me years to get where I am now.

BUT the (hardcore) fighting game community is very friendly. With the decline of arcades and the mass popularity of other genres taking away from fighters, we can't afford not to be.

Check out shoryuken.com forums. Ask questions, the users are very noob friendly and will explain anything you need. Search beforehand though, alot of questions get reposted.

There are plenty of great fighters out there, and I'd be hardpressed to pick a best. I have no problem picking out the shitty titles however. Mortal Kombat is garbage. DOA is garbage. Soul Calibur is borderline garbage. Killer Instinct is garbage. This doesn't mean they can't be fun. But from a competitive and quality standpoint, they just don't compare.

Tekken is decent. I'm biased against 3D fighters though. To me they just seem like simple guessing games. Not nearly as much depth as the good 2D titles.

Largest fanbase is anything Street Fighter or Capcom, without a doubt. Most players start there, then branch out to other series.

SF4 is a decent place to start. I used to think that SF3:3s was the best beginning point for new fighting game players, but SF4 is a step above. Mostly because of the Challenges. They teach you the moves and start you off with some combos and show you what sorts of things are possible.

The online play is a bit disappointing because it doesn't really show you how great the community could be. There are alot of Halo-like assholes who play, throwing hissy fits and disconnecting, spamming the same moves with cheap characters... I would encourage you to try and find a decent arcade in your area.

So yeah, get the game, play around a bit, check out the SRK forums, ask tons of questions.


*ObZ

[Anima Mundi]

Broken as in everyone plays as Ken, and I rarely could even get a hit in on their bitch-easy combo system.

[ObsidianZ]

Protip:

Stop jumping
Learn to block
Play Sagat (he's even cheaper and easier)



*ObZ

[Cegstar]

Protip:

Stop jumping
Learn to block
Play Sagat (he's even cheaper and easier)



*ObZ
Or learn Zangeif. I have a few perfect victories versus Ken due to this.

[Trueborn]

Broken as in everyone plays as Ken, and I rarely could even get a hit in on their bitch-easy combo system.

Oh. In that case, I agree with you. However, the Ken players are very, VERY predictable. Easily taken out once you figure out that they all do the exact same thing.

[ObsidianZ]

Gief got really beefed up this time around. Eats scrubs for breakfast.

Green fist > SPD all day long. Lariat on wakeup. Lariat vs everything.


*ObZ

[pill popper]

Protip:

Stop jumping
Learn to block
Play Sagat (he's even cheaper and easier)



*ObZ

sagat has also ways been cheap

gonna pick this up on friday

[ObsidianZ]

^This is true.

If you guys are having problems getting in on fireballers, don't forget about Force Attacks. You can either dash cancel after absorbing the fireball, or let the force attack hit if you're in range.

I guarantee you'll piss off some scrubs.


*ObZ

[ObsidianZ]

Surprisingly, I haven't been seeing as many Kens lately. But I have a newfound hate for faggoty Akuma runaway-fireballers. CViper just can't get in. I hate how anyone without a fireball is automatically lower tier than someone who does. In 3S, no one fireballed because you could parry. Yet another problem with taking too much from SF2.

Also, interesting note: DP motions (623) can sometimes be inputted simply by 33. Makes those Challenge Trials a bit easier. I can't get it to come out 100% of the time though and the timing is a bit tricky.


*ObZ

[Snoopy]

Damn, I need to pick this up asap.

[ObsidianZ]

I hate this game.


*ObZ

[Anima Mundi]

I hate this game.


*ObZ

SAAAAME!

[matt110]

http://www.geekstir.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/kenflow.jpg

[ObsidianZ]

I hate all these goddamn scrub turtles. They get scared when I show some skill so they revert to run away mode. I'm chasing them all over the screen through fireballs and DP's. It's boring, it's pointless, it's frustrating, it's the same bullshit that ruined SF2.

*ObZ

[sdmf_from_hell]

What about playing through the campaign at increasingly difficult settings? i'm assuming 4 has it considering this is the basis of previous titles.

or just masturbate to chun li if your into asian chicks

[Cegstar]

What about playing through the campaign at increasingly difficult settings? i'm assuming 4 has it considering this is the basis of previous titles.

or just masturbate to chun li if your into asian chicks

It's really fun to play at the hardest difficulty settings.

[ObsidianZ]

Fighting games are never about the single player.

I'm just pissed off that the game system promotes turtling so much.


*ObZ

[ScaryGary]

You know, after numerous consecutive losses, my first win online was, humorously, with Dan. on randomized pick. at the character selection screen, I like to go to the randomize pick box until the opponent picks their character, and then I pick which I feel will work best against them. well, last night I did this, and the opponent did the same. I hit it since I thought he would, and it set me with Dan. he then manually went and picked his character. this guy had a battle point score of nearly 2,000. I had nil. yet he got fucking stomped.

funny enough, I seem to stand a better chance against people of my actual skill level and above, than I do against those far below it. I can't understand what it is. but I suck against people who suck. but it's alright now, because I found my true favorite character: M Bison, folks. this dude is a fucking beast, and I am a beast with him (not boasting). I got a good number of wins against people in the 1,500+ BP range with him, last night. fairly, too. it's difficult to be cheap with Bison (and most other charge characters). infact, I got a good number of PSN friend add requests from these same players. and by the way, ObsidianZ; did you get mine?

I also put up some pretty good fights with Blanka.

[ObsidianZ]

Gary, you're SoundJam right? I sent a friend invite a while ago...try adding me ObsidianZ.

Bison's moves are all very safe and he hits hard. His only weakness is that he lacks a good anti-air.

As for being better against proper players...You have to remember that mindgames do not work on scrubs. They don't see what you're doing. All they know is that if you move, FLAMING DRAGON PUNCH. Sadly, it works.

I hate fighting Blanka CPU :p. I haven't met a person who plays him yet.



*ObZ

[ScaryGary]

ObsidianZ. there should be an add request notification in your message box. I sent you one last night, and am pretty sure I entered it correctly. it was a valid username; and if I remember right, you had about 30% of SFIV's PSN trophies, just to varify. my time with the PSN is limited to about once or twice a week, as I'm only able to get on while at a friend's house (highspeed isn't availible in my area. it's the mid-90's around here.). but yeah, I'm SoundJam, anyhow. it MAY be Sound_Jam, actually. one is my PSN, the other is my Konami ID for Metal Gear Online (fuckin' confusing Konami ID shit).

I suppose Bison's Devil Reverse would make for a decent anti-air, if you could manage to time and guide it correctly. it's a little unpredictble as he tends to fling around wildly, unguided. also, Double Knee Press contains some properties which could discourage jump-in attacks by opponents, atleast to some extent. though when it comes to anti-air, he's still no Blanka.

[ScaryGary]

Bison's mid-air high punch could serves as an anti-air, as well; if you land it at the right frames, of course. meanwhile, I'm running through his Trial in Challenge Mode. he's got some fairly difficult combos. shit I'm having trouble pulling off on a still standing Dan, let alone a player controlled character. I'm talking mid-air MK's to crouching MK's to Ultra attacks; which is generally simple to pull off, but it's much more of a bitch as Bison's Super is a charge attack. I've tried getting the charge and crouch in as early as once I'm mid-air, toward the enemy. it's certainly difficult, but surely I'll pull it off atleast once, just enough to get through with the Trials.

as far as Specials, Supers, Ultras and general attacks, I suppose I've got Bison down, but Technically, I've got some practice to do.

[ObsidianZ]

I finished all the normal Trials this afternoon. I've done a couple of the hard trials. They take alot of links and tricky cancels. CViper's Hard Trials are more insane than the others, you have to incorporate high jump cancels and thunder knuckle/seismic feints. It's 99% luck for some of this stuff :(.

If you have any problems with the trials:

http://www.youtube.com/user/kalelulen4

Vids on each characters' normal/hard trials.


*ObZ

[Cegstar]

I just had an awesome pwnage that I felt I'd post... not that anyone will really care.

I did a battle against an online user, he picked Ken 12 times in a row. The only time he was I was Zangeif, he literally fireballed me ONCE and ran like a little girl after and it timed out.

On fight 13, he picked blanka. I picked Dhalsim. Round three we both had almost no health left, so I went for my ultimate. He jumped over my incredibly slow moving fireball, did his rolling attacked, and flung back - right into my fireball.

It was likely the funniest thing I've seen in this game yet.

[ObsidianZ]

With Dhalsim, knock them down, then use ultra before they get up. They're stuck blocking the big slow fireball and you're free to hit them low/high (if they're standing or crouching) or go up and throw them.

It's pretty much impossible to combo into his ultra unless you FA in the corner.

Have you guys encountered an El Fuerte yet? Hilarious! Crazy Mexican luchador running around constantly body-slamming you. It's a little annoying because it crosses up so easily and hits in the air. Still funny to see though.

"TOSTADA PRESS!"

:D


*ObZ

[Cegstar]

With Dhalsim, knock them down, then use ultra before they get up. They're stuck blocking the big slow fireball and you're free to hit them low/high (if they're standing or crouching) or go up and throw them.

It's pretty much impossible to combo into his ultra unless you FA in the corner.

Have you guys encountered an El Fuerte yet? Hilarious! Crazy Mexican luchador running around constantly body-slamming you. It's a little annoying because it crosses up so easily and hits in the air. Still funny to see though.

"TOSTADA PRESS!"

:D


*ObZ
He's fun to play when you're against Ken. Every dragon punch can be reversed with his one special move.

[BATTLESTEER]

yea el fuerte is pretty fucking annoying. And all he did was fucking run around trying to body slam u. Its pretty easy to just upercut him while hes coming down, once u see him in the air he really has no more control over where hes going except into a fist

I really havent found a favorite yet, still working on getting the characters. Just need gouken and seth, but ive come to a liking with akuma. hes pretty good if you no how to use him.

[Cegstar]

yea el fuerte is pretty fucking annoying. And all he did was fucking run around trying to body slam u. Its pretty easy to just upercut him while hes coming down, once u see him in the air he really has no more control over where hes going except into a fist

I really havent found a favorite yet, still working on getting the characters. Just need gouken and seth, but ive come to a liking with akuma. hes pretty good if you no how to use him.

The only thing to "figure out" about Akuma is his ultimate combo. Otherwise he's just like Ken in cheapness.

Blanka and Zangeif for the win! Sometimes Sagat too.

[ObsidianZ]

Akuma :rolleyes:

hadoken hadoken air hadoken fire hadoken on wakeup air hadoken jumping hurricane kick escape hadoken DP jump ins and wakeup run away hadoken RAGING DEMON

For the record, that's not how to play him.

A proper Akuma is rushdown, not runaway. With kara demons, not a random demon when you're getting up.

Sagat is way too good. Easy combos into Ultra, high damage even on normals, everything is very comboable, plus his old keepaway games.

Tiger Uppercut xx FADC > Ultra 60% damage!!


*ObZ