Bicycle theft

Sal, a man-deer · #1 05-07-2012, 11:49 PM

So everyday I see these fixed gear bikes with expensive Brooks saddles and Thomson stems and posts, carbon wheels etc locked up around town. They're mostly locked with kryptonite u locks which are tough as fuck. So do I put glue in the lock or something and hope they leave it there over night them come down with my boltcutters in the middle of the night or what? Someone give me hints and stories about bicycle and component theft please.

Sal, a man-deer · #2 05-07-2012, 11:50 PM

Ohh and I'm in TX if that makes a difference. Just with laws about carrying bolt cutters and shit

Vape · #3 05-08-2012, 01:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sal, a man-deer

So everyday I see these fixed gear bikes with expensive Brooks saddles and Thomson stems and posts, carbon wheels etc locked up around town. They're mostly locked with kryptonite u locks which are tough as fuck. So do I put glue in the lock or something and hope they leave it there over night them come down with my boltcutters in the middle of the night or what? Someone give me hints and stories about bicycle and component theft please.

You should speak hypothetically.

**skygear** · #4 05-08-2012, 02:06 AM

Big market for bike parts on the net... Look on ebay.

JustinBieberz · #5 05-08-2012, 02:16 AM

To get through those U-Locks, bolt cutters might not cut it. You may need power tools, and those are not easy to use without drawing attention.

**skygear** · #6 05-08-2012, 02:59 AM

I got a 4 ft pair that cuts everything. Again people, own the situation. you walk up sketch that brings attention. Walk up like you aren't doing anything wrong and no one pays attention.

Theres also the buddy method - have one person go to the bike, call you and pretend to try their key. Make sure they have a bike helmet to look the part. Show up with your cutters or a cut-off wheel and do your work. Have the person pay you cash in plain view, like a $20 or something... Let the person with the helmet ride off with the bike and meet you around the corner. You go a different direction too.

**skygear** · #7 05-08-2012, 03:01 AM

I have a set of the Greenly Pro grade cutters. But Sears and other Hardware stores carry a new off the shelf foldable set of Bolt Cutters.

TheyCallMeNothing · #8 05-08-2012, 04:00 AM

What skygear said..

I mean if you look the part you can do just about anything.

CHEERS

Jack · #9 05-08-2012, 04:06 AM

Bike Thief 2012 - YouTube

**skygear** · #10 05-08-2012, 04:32 AM

So... Point proven? I think so.

TheyCallMeNothing · #11 05-08-2012, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack

Bike Thief 2012 - YouTube

Okay go with skygear's plan then. Simple enough, lol.

**skygear** · #12 05-08-2012, 06:24 PM

Not a plan.... Its a hypothetical solution to an issue.

Computer · #13 05-08-2012, 06:28 PM

get a hacksaw

ratfrink · #14 05-08-2012, 08:33 PM

The only bike you'll be able to steal with a hacksaw is a bike with a shit lock, i.e. a shit bike.

**skygear** · #15 05-08-2012, 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ratfrink

The only bike you'll be able to steal with a hacksaw is a bike with a shit lock, i.e. a shit bike.

Not true. If its metal, there are hand tools that will be able to cut it.

ratfrink · #16 05-08-2012, 09:34 PM

In independent tests, top-quality locks take 2-3 minutes to cut through one side (these locks are double-shackled so need two cuts to release them) with petrol-powered angle grinders. You could cut through them with a hacksaw, but it would take literally all day.

Being technically able to cut through a lock is very different from being able to steal a bicycle in real-world conditions.

Sal, a man-deer · #17 05-08-2012, 10:38 PM

How about just stealing components off locked up bikes. I suppose someone could steal seats and posts easily enough. Even handlebars if they snip the brake cables.

Zok Jr. · #18 05-08-2012, 11:04 PM

I work in the bike industry and just so you know kryptonite locks are crap, the only U-lock we can't cut with our 3' bolt cutters are "Buffalo" brand locks, but even those are cut-able, just one time we broke a pair of bolt cutters on one.

ratfrink · #19 05-09-2012, 12:56 AM

What the fuck are you talking about? The Kryp Fahgeddaboudit is the best D-Lock on the market. Read the test:

http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/catego...dit-mini-16565

They couldn't damage it using hand tools (breaker bar, hacksaw, bolt croppers) and it took three minutes to cut one side with an angle grinder. If they were as shit as you make them out to be, anyone that uses them would have their bikes nicked. I've never heard of 'Buffalo' locks; I did a Google search and nothing remotely relevant came up - presumably when you say 'I work in the bike industry...' you mean 'I work in a bike shop which these cheap Chinese locks'. If this lock is so much better than the Fahg, how come there are no reviews, it's not for sale online, and it doesn't have a website?

To be honest it sounds like you're talking out of your arse.

Zok Jr. · #20 05-09-2012, 01:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ratfrink

What the fuck are you talking about? The Kryp Fahgeddaboudit is the best D-Lock on the market. Read the test:

http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/catego...dit-mini-16565

They couldn't damage it using hand tools (breaker bar, hacksaw, bolt croppers) and it took three minutes to cut one side with an angle grinder. If they were as shit as you make them out to be, anyone that uses them would have their bikes nicked. I've never heard of 'Buffalo' locks; I did a Google search and nothing remotely relevant came up - presumably when you say 'I work in the bike industry...' you mean 'I work in a bike shop which these cheap Chinese locks'. If this lock is so much better than the Fahg, how come there are no reviews, it's not for sale online, and it doesn't have a website?

To be honest it sounds like you're talking out of your arse.

Wow, the only fahg around here is you buddy, whats up your ass? lol.

You mad because someone decided to contribute some info that you deem yourself the king of? Sorry my liege, your lock knowledge is much greater than anyones, you are so righteous and great oh lock master of bike stuff.

Also I was talking about regular u-locks, not mini u-locks that pretty much nobody has. Go suck a bicycle's dick, bitch.

bortmackie · #21 05-09-2012, 01:27 AM

Man, fuck stealing bikes. Get your own bike motherfucker. I had my bike stolen when i was a kid, and damn did that suck. I loved that bike. If you want a bike, get your own. Don't punish people for getting exercise and being environmentally friendly. People put a lot of hard work into maintaining them and can be pretty attached to them. I know it's pretty stupid to preach morals in BI, but why don't you find a crime that doesn't require being such a douchebag?

ratfrink · #22 05-09-2012, 01:30 AM

Nobody has Fahg locks? I see them all the time. I must see at least a dozen a day in central London. Besides, they do a 'regular' sized version too.

Lol at "lock master". It's a great comeback, especially from someone who previously claimed to be the expert themselves ("I work in the bike industry"). Just ignore the evidence, hide behind the insults, and pretend you're not butthurt...

Zok Jr. · #23 05-09-2012, 02:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ratfrink

Nobody has Fahg locks? I see them all the time. I must see at least a dozen a day in central London. Besides, they do a 'regular' sized version too.

Lol at "lock master". It's a great comeback, especially from someone who previously claimed to be the expert themselves ("I work in the bike industry"). Just ignore the evidence, hide behind the insults, and pretend you're not butthurt...

"I work in the bike industry" =/= I am the expert on locks. I don't see how anyone at all could draw that conclusion but kudos to you for thinking outside the box I guess. Seriously though lrn2readingcomprehension.

Anyways, I am in California and I have never seen one of those fahg locks before, nor have I seen a mini-u lock. Out of all of the u-locks I have ever cut only the buffalo locks ever give us trouble which is the exact thing I said previously. The bolt cutters cut through kryptonite just as easy as any other brand except buffalo. I have cut maybe 100 locks in my time however that does not make me an expert on the subject at all. I am just adding some info based on personal experience. Take it as you will.

**skygear** · #24 05-09-2012, 02:53 AM

I got a pair of these http://www.greenlee.com/products/CUT...oduct_id=18431

Let me tell you. I have not found a lock or chain I have not been able to cut with them. I have helped many people in my time who "lost their keys"....

http://dewalt.com/tools/cordless-met...-dcg412l2.aspx
This little tool- Makes short work too.

http://www.dremel.com/en-us/Tools/Pa....aspx?pid=8000

Yeah, that one too...

I have used all of those - not one lock/ chain stood up longer than 55sec...

I own the dremel and the bolt cutters. Used a buddys dewalt for testing purposes. Works very well, I just didn't like the noise or all the sparks.

ratfrink · #25 05-09-2012, 09:41 AM

People must use shit locks where you guys live. None of those tools would even scratch a Kryptonite Fahg, Kryptonite M-18, Abus Granit Extreme etc - these are the locks that people use in central London, Oxford, York and other high-crime areas. They've all been tested and are resistant to everything except full-sized angle grinders.

Cable locks are all shit; there's no such thing as a good cable lock. The only chain locks that are any good are those ridiculously heavy ones used to secure motorcycles; they weigh about 10kg so people leave them at work.

Really, if you see a bike locked up with a Fahg, don't bother trying to steal it. Mine has scratches all over from sawblades, and a pair of tiny dints where somebody has tried to bolt-cropper it; the damage is totally superficial.

ysr2096 · #26 05-09-2012, 11:10 AM

Sheds and garages are where the real money is.

unstableasatable · #27 05-09-2012, 11:34 AM

strong D locks have simple keys, would it not just be easier to pick the lock?

**skygear** · #28 05-09-2012, 01:28 PM

Wow - you said it - "RESISTS"
what is the difference between a large angle grinder and a small one? the diameter of the wheels! THats it! Same materials, some are even the same brands... ITS METAL, and thus there are tools meant to work with METAL that work.

Carbide cuts Kryptonite Lock - YouTube

Cutting a U-lock with a saw - YouTube

ABUS Bordo 6000 broken in 30 seconds with disc grinder - YouTube

Non-Almax security chains for bikes vs Bolt Croppers - YouTube

Thats only a 36" Bolt cutter/ cropper Mine is a 42"... I love this video by the way. watched it in 2008 and laughed! The last chain is the Fahg

Could happen

Gone In 60 Seconds - The Bike Crime Wave Part 2 - YouTube

**skygear** · #29 05-09-2012, 01:34 PM

Bolt cutters settle boot dispute, for now - YouTube

U-lock vs angle grinder - YouTube

**skygear** · #30 05-09-2012, 01:40 PM

Kryptonite "U" lock picked - YouTube

Kryptonite Lock Mayhem - YouTube

vovka351 · #31 05-09-2012, 01:41 PM

see if there's any with a traditional lock-face... you know, like on masterlock padlocks and your front door. get a 1/8" drill, drill above the keyway (where the part that turns meets the lock body). Stick flathead screwdriver in drilled lock, turn, free bike.

**skygear** · #32 05-09-2012, 01:46 PM

Destructive

Sheldon brown locking method potential flaw - YouTube

ratfrink · #33 05-09-2012, 02:27 PM

Holy shit son, none of the locks you posted were the ones that I was talking about. Unsurprisingly, shit locks are easier to cut through than good ones - don't you understand this? The lock-picking videos are old... Kryptonite recalled all of them years ago; the new design is totally different.

The fact remains that it took a full-sized angle grinder three minutes to cut through one side of a Fagh D-lock. These locks are double-shackled so you need to make two cuts in the lock to remove them. That's six minutes cutting time alone. A larger angle grinder is more powerful than a smaller one (minimum 1,500w) so you won't be able to remove a Fagh in six minutes with your little 300w Dremel. Oh, and most people with a decent bike use two locks.

When testers say 'resistant' to hand tools, what they mean is that they haven't done any significant damage within five minutes. No lock is impregnable if you have enough time... but unless you find a bike locked up in an abandoned industrial estate, you don't have hours to cut through it.

**skygear** · #34 05-09-2012, 02:48 PM

You know, your right about 1 thing. I didn't post one about the fahg lock since there weren't any that i found. Rest assured, I have cut them. The videos were more for the OP. And as for the Bic pen trick, yeah, dated... but then again, how many of those locks were released before the recall? MILLIONS! and the recall was voluntary, meaning YOU had to send YOUR lock in to have it re cylindered. You really think everyone knew about the recall? and even less wanted to pay the expensive shipping to them.

Picking was mentioned, so I just posted them... the new style keys are in many videos there too. You need to look for them. I actually have a pick specifically designed for that style of keyway. Same for the Jaguar, Ford, VW etc "laser cut" keyways... They are actually Router cut, no laser involved at all.

If there were a couple around town here that wanted to donate a lock to me, I'd be more than happy to post the video up. I will go to a few bike shops and see if there are any around for "testing"

I feel you aren't really taking into consideration the videos I posted... One in particular that uses the same steel and thicknesses of the lock..

Non-Almax security chains for bikes vs Bolt Croppers - YouTube

The last thing they cut is the fahg...

**skygear** · #35 05-09-2012, 02:53 PM

Truth of the matter is, if its a bike someone wants to steal... Its gone. If it is another bike in the line with an easier lock, yeah, someone might move to that one.

Hydraulic jacks are a factor here too. A tool that I didn't mention before due to there non- off the shelf availability.

Zok Jr. · #36 05-09-2012, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skygear

You know, your right about 1 thing. I didn't post one about the fahg lock since there weren't any that i found. Rest assured, I have cut them. The videos were more for the OP. And as for the Bic pen trick, yeah, dated... but then again, how many of those locks were released before the recall? MILLIONS! and the recall was voluntary, meaning YOU had to send YOUR lock in to have it re cylindered. You really think everyone knew about the recall? and even less wanted to pay the expensive shipping to them.

Picking was mentioned, so I just posted them... the new style keys are in many videos there too. You need to look for them. I actually have a pick specifically designed for that style of keyway. Same for the Jaguar, Ford, VW etc "laser cut" keyways... They are actually Router cut, no laser involved at all.

If there were a couple around town here that wanted to donate a lock to me, I'd be more than happy to post the video up. I will go to a few bike shops and see if there are any around for "testing"

I feel you aren't really taking into consideration the videos I posted... One in particular that uses the same steel and thicknesses of the lock..

Non-Almax security chains for bikes vs Bolt Croppers - YouTube

The last thing they cut is the fahg...

Wow the kryptonite fahg chain seemed to be one of if not the weakest one in that video.

**skygear** · #37 05-09-2012, 03:07 PM

Yeah, within the first few seconds of the attempt. Then the second side was a pain due the the fatigue of the guy cutting all the chains. There was a bunch of the vids from Almax people and in one or two of them he admitted that it was tiring. Also they changed the Bolt cutter heads in one of the videos just to make sure they were not messing up the test.

I own one of the Almax chains now. I have tried with my bolt cutters and they hold up.

My motorcycle has 2 of them attached to in ground anchor points.

ratfrink · #38 05-09-2012, 03:52 PM

The Fagh chain does not use the same steel, nor the same thickness of steel (11mm vs 18mm) as the Fagh D-Lock! Besides, I specifically said that chains (enormous motorbike chains excepted) are not a good way of locking your bike. The 2003 Bic thing was what, nearly ten years ago... hardly anyone is using those locks any more.

Hydraulic jacks are no use against a Fagh. There's no room to put one in; all the space inside the jack is taken up by the frame, the stand, and one of the rims. In a public place, how would you remove it?

**skygear** · #39 05-09-2012, 04:26 PM

At this point I have no idea what all this back and forth is about. It Is STEEL - Hardened or not, IT CAN BE CUT! The only thing here I can see you might not be able to grasp is WHAT TOOL>... VS Time... the Hydra Shear (hydraulic bolt cutters) were built for this...

Quote:

Yeah, you can still pry a u-lock apart but you'd need a giant lever and the lock better be very close to the pivot... plus you'll look sorta suspicious with a 5 foot 50lb pry-bar. Most u-locks are defeated by hydraulic bottle jacks or the thing the bicycle was locked to it broken - usually the weaker of the two. Thick U-locks and a very sturdy locking point are still the only suitable option for high-theft areas. Don't use a chain either... unless maybe to lockup a front-wheel... long bolt cutters will make short work of them.

Quote:

bolt cutters can cut any U-lock. you just have to have the right size of bolt cutters.
And unfortunately, sharpened bolt cutters or new ones can cut cables as well.

As a challenge to break 20-30-50mm of steel I would probably use a hydraulic cutter (there are manual hydraulic cutters also) and in extension it could degenerate into "jaws of life". But since I already entered the industrial scale, then a plasma cutter would be more compact than the engine needed for the jaws of life.

But as said before, u-locks can fail by prying them, also the locks may fail.

Quote:

Kryptonite New York Fahgettaboudit Mini

If the double deadbolt mechanism and ridiculously thick 18mm shackle made of hardened steel isn’t enough to deter a thief, nothing will. The lock is small, making it tricky to fit your wheel, frame and an item of street furniture in, but the lack of excess space makes it tough for a would-be thief to try a leverage attack or squeeze a bottle jack in. It is heavy, with a weight of approx. 1.9kg or 4.2lbs and is best transported in a bag.
Price: approx. $90

Duelist · #40 05-09-2012, 04:51 PM

As someone who just had their bike stolen a few weeks ago, I just came to say that I will kill anyone I find stealing any one's bike, anywhere. I think a lot of my fellow cyclists feel the same way and when we are enraged we can be a dangerous group.

Find something better to steal please. A lot of people depend on their bike for transportation and without it they are helpless.

so let me just say again

FUCK YOU!

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