Archived: PRRT Z01- Pyro Related Random Thread

[HeaT]

Just go with me on this one, guys. For now.

Ready...... GO!

[Dream of the iris]

Nice lol! Here's something interesting. A chem professor at my university published a research paper entitled, "Crystal lattice effects on orientation and orbital degeneracy of nitric oxide trapped in nitrame stage 4 crystals"

The nitramines he used were RDX and HNIW

[InspiredByMe]

Originally Posted by Dream of the iris

Nice lol! Here's something interesting. A chem professor at my university published a research paper entitled, "Crystal lattice effects on orientation and orbital degeneracy of nitric oxide trapped in nitrame stage 4 crystals"

The nitramines he used were RDX and HNIW

Can you get said paper?

[asilentbob]

PRRT: Nice.

Tzar was telling me last night about some sexy e-matches she made with acetone, DBSP, and graphite. The idea is not new. I just wonder if any particular brand of DBSP has enough graphite to make perfectly resistive heads without need for additives... Such would be awesome for DIY mass production... And they would be much more stable than normal commercial e-matches that are generally based on some sort of chlorate composition.. some you can practically strike like matches, course they will just pop like normal...

Posted from mah cell...

(On second thought... I don't see NG as having a place in e-matches...)

[Hydroponichronic]

Heh, PRRT. I used to be a regular at BB, but then I moved on to real chemistry . I jest, of course, but one concern that was voiced a while back was that the science of BB seems to be at a stall. As a more flashy science (lol @ my pun), it tends to draw a lot of n0oBz. I think it might be worth collectively figuring out how to deal with them so to turn them from the dark side. Clandestine science could use a boost, and BB is a great way to draw some new people in. IDK, but with more people involved in such a cool hobby, maybe we can sway public opinion to not view science as boring.

Hey, and as to future of BB stuff, FAE's seem pretty cool, and they seem pretty OTC, which is the main criterion for most people. Anywho, there's that.


GL/HF/BS/FTP

[Dream of the iris]

Originally Posted by InspiredByMe

Can you get said paper?

Yeah, but it says he ordered them. He didn't synthesize them.


FAEs? OTC? Pssh. There's a lot more to them then just making a fireball. In fact, there's not much fire in a true FAE as the fuel detonates.

[Von Bass]

Originally Posted by Hydroponichronic

As a more flashy science (lol @ my pun), it tends to draw a lot of n0oBz. I think it might be worth collectively figuring out how to deal with them so to turn them from the dark side. Clandestine science could use a boost, and BB is a great way to draw some new people in.

I find that proposition vaugely disturbing to be honest man! I rather like the idea of people coming in of their own volition, starting with pyro, preferably moving onto HE, then preferably branching to what area they should so desire, drawing in a larger and larger userbase tends to draw in a larger base of retards, kewls, people who'll say 'YEH I CUD MAEK TEH MEFF', etc etc

It's rather undeniable that quite a few of us did start with BB related activities, and then suddenly felt the draw of those tasty organic molecules though, so obviously we should absolutely leave it to happen. I just don't think we should draw kids in with promises of explosives and drugs... sounds like a Faux news report and Zoklet getting an influx of retards / us being arrested for being terrorists/communists/criminals.

Oh, and as for me, I totally felt the draw of a good ol' NG synth not so long back, methinks that's next when I get some time

[Irukanji]

I started with HE, move on to pyro, then went onto organic chemistry and drug's/poisons.

Only research though, havent had the time/money for any chems lately, so....

[InspiredByMe]

Originally Posted by wolfy_9005

Only research though, havent had the time/money for any chems lately, so....

I know what you mean

I started with small pyro stuff then on to many many HE then...well I'm still thinking about it, those organics are alluring.

[Hydroponichronic]

Originally Posted by Dream of the iris

FAEs? OTC? Pssh. There's a lot more to them then just making a fireball. In fact, there's not much fire in a true FAE as the fuel detonates.

Actually, I have to plead ignorance here. I imagine FAE's could do some cool sh!t if worked properly. Care to spoonfeed me some info?

Originally Posted by Von Bass

I find that proposition vaugely disturbing to be honest man! I rather like the idea of people coming in of their own volition, starting with pyro, preferably moving onto HE, then preferably branching to what area they should so desire

I understand what you're saying, and agree, sort of.

Originally Posted by Von Bass

drawing in a larger and larger userbase tends to draw in a larger base of retards, kewls, people who'll say 'YEH I CUD MAEK TEH MEFF', etc etc

It seems I've miscommunicated. I don't want to draw more in, I simply was hoping to find a way so that those kidiots/kewls who are already drawn in, rather than making some ghetto AP and deciding to be delinquents, would take an interest in pyro and the like for what it really is: science, rather than making some ghetto AP and deciding to be delinquents. I can't speak for others, but I know pleanty of people who got curious, made some kind of IED, then just got out of it to go do other stupid shit. The trick is, IMO, when they (the curious kidiots) come around, we need to find some way to make it less about the bang and more about the engineering, so to speak. Unfortunately, I haven't the foggiest idea how.

Originally Posted by Von Bass

It's rather undeniable that quite a few of us did start with BB related activities, and then suddenly felt the draw of those tasty organic molecules though, so obviously we should absolutely leave it to happen.

This is what we need to look at. Something about us (the ones who stuck with it) was different. What made us really start enjoying the science? Were we all just naturally intelligent people? Or at some point did we think something that made us stick with it? I don't know. All I'm saying is that if there's a way to turn the inevitable kewls that come 'round into legitimate scientists, we should do it.

Originally Posted by Von Bass

I just don't think we should draw kids in with promises of explosives and drugs... sounds like a Faux news report and Zoklet getting an influx of retards / us being arrested for being terrorists/communists/criminals.

Ahh, yes... the fear. &T had this problem, IIRC. It was those damned text files (KFB!). Half the shit was cut straight from the anarchists cook book. With everything all spelled out, the standard kewl just makes some IED and doesn't have to think about it. All they think about is "where to I make boom-boom?" Take a guess where that leads.

Originally Posted by Von Bass

Faux news report

It's funny because it's true. lol

[asilentbob]

It tends to vary I imagine... Different possibilities or combination's of them...

Perhaps at some point we all got really interested in something in particular... and went through MANY google search results pages learning a ton... Then we realized that that could be applied to a lot of the other pyro stuff and it kinda spiraled out of control from there...

Or we started reading a topic in a pyro forum and found it interesting... interesting enough to read more and more topics from the forum... spiraling out from there...

Or something else... Whatever it is we seem to all have a few things in common... like:
*We compulsively read ingredient labels on products unless we have read them before, or don't expect them to have anything of interest.

[Dream of the iris]

Actually, I have to plead ignorance here. I imagine FAE's could do some cool sh!t if worked properly. Care to spoonfeed me some info?

A true FAE involves two explosive charges and a fuel source. The first charge disperases the fuel source, the second charge detonates it.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xquGETNoRms


A lot of good info here: http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/v...id=7762&page=3

[asilentbob]

There are a lot of interesting possibilities... Depending on if you want a fireball or more of a detonation.

I wonder what melted naphthalene with a charge to atomize it and a charge to ignite it would do... Just thinking... I know some of us have this shit just sitting around stinking up the place even through 2 ziplock bags. Its a stinky hassle to powder it for small mortar fired fire balls... but melting it might be less of a hassle.

Also along the lines of high carbon content fuels, I wonder about very hot melted wax.

I wonder about dissolving DBSP in fuels... It has both NG and NC and could possibly help contribute to everything getting burned up completely and a large volume of gases produced... IIRC NG used to be stabilized by dissolving it in acetone... If you used enough acetone to make it not detonate by the dispersion charge, it might be a good fuel. Then like mentioned on SMDB there are various nitrites like isopropyl nitrite that could contribute a bit of oxygen.

I dunno. Something about that video (is nice.)

[Dream of the iris]

Bob, that's interesting. Wish I had the space and materials to test it

Gasoline would be interesting to see detonated.


Back in my experimental (Dumbass) days, I made a rocket with AP.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qNRJW...eature=related

That's not me, but it was similar to that.


Hey, nuclearrabbit I found one of your vids on youtube!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hodaL...eature=related

[HeaT]

On the topic of plasticized acetone peroxide-

Very good detonation, and very convenient. I can safely report (heh) that a mixture of acetone peroxide and nitrocellulose (from ping pong balls) will detonate. Probably not fully, as i felt shrapnel (probably nitrocellulose), but I used too much NC, about seventy percent. Thirty should effectively plasticize the mixture, and allow a much more thorough detonation.

Add an amount of nitrocellulose, or sliced ping pong balls to acetone, along with equal, or twice the volume of acetone peroxide. Let sit until fully dissolved, stirring with anything that is not metal or soluble in acetone. Scrape into container of your choice (matchbox!). Let dry and have fun. I hear adding a sparkler while still gelatinous makes an excellent fuse.

[asilentbob]

Technically you shouldn't do that... Some of the AP will dissolve in the acetone and creep up into the sparkler... And if a spark hit some of this early on... it might not be pretty. I do understand the novelty of being able to just insert the fuse and all and let all the acetone evaporate away over a few days so you have a solid package with everything there... But if its dissolved, its going to creep and you should really find a way to avoid that.

[HeaT]

Originally Posted by asilentbob

Technically you shouldn't do that... Some of the AP will dissolve in the acetone and creep up into the sparkler... And if a spark hit some of this early on... it might not be pretty. I do understand the novelty of being able to just insert the fuse and all and let all the acetone evaporate away over a few days so you have a solid package with everything there... But if its dissolved, its going to creep and you should really find a way to avoid that.

wait until dry and duct tape?

[asilentbob]

Sure. Chances are the creeping wouldn't be enough to cause trouble... but the possibility is there...

Also, in the forum description, we should quickly remove "weapons."

[Dream of the iris]

Also, in the forum description, we should quickly remove "weapons."

Agreed. I'll take it up with the the mods.

[Flamethrowa]

Why hello all. I've decided to join Zoklet since this is apparently the rebirth of BB. One thing though. the vBullish nature of this forum now has us searchable by google. typing "zoklet there's a pyro asilentbob" turns up results for posts. once enough of us get huge postcounts it may turn up simply by searching a username. is there a way around this?

in an unrelated note, would it be possible to nitrate melamine or cyanuric acid? so much nitrogen! imagine the volume of gas! and probably OB+!

[Irukanji]

Originally Posted by HeaT

I can safely report (heh) that a mixture of acetone peroxide

These 2 words dont belong in the same sentence

[nuclearrabbit]

My experience with the hobby chemist community, mainly the pyros, I feel we all have similar personalities.

Doady, I have your rocket video. Cyclone fence is adequate protection.

I got to see an AC-130 fuckin' some shit up this week. 105mm rounds from the sky is pretty badass.

I've got so many ideas for you guys... Water charges being the broadest one. Also detonating straight AN easily. Though, as you all know, in the pyro world you can only choose two; cheap, safe, or easy.

[Dream of the iris]

I didn't think I posted that one... Can you upload it?

[nuclearrabbit]

Originally Posted by Dream of the iris

I didn't think I posted that one... Can you upload it?

Don't have it here at Eglin but next time I'm home, no problem.

[InspiredByMe]

Water charges...I got a river out back

[nuclearrabbit]

Originally Posted by InspiredByMe

Water charges...I got a river out back

More like Hydra-Jet, Van Trepan, MWBSC, boot banger, that type of thing. NBK2K has, of course, covered this.

http://www.roguesci.org/theforum/showthread.php?t=5149

[asilentbob]

Hey nuke... ya know how shaped charges are generally just conical or linear? Why not make one so that you get a flying circle of molten metal... Like ugh... a ring of metal that flies in one direction... Not like those pipe cutting charges that are wrapped around a pipe. Weird to explain.

EDIT: Oh and nuke, I'm looking to get something like this to fill with some 1st aid supplies and strap to my backpack:
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/MOLLE718-1.html
Have you seen these in person by chance? Are they nice and well built?
Also looking for a hydration bladder carrier... BUT might just go get that at the nearest army surplus store as they seem to be much more common than these med bags.

[nuclearrabbit]

I think I got what you mean for a circular SC. Like a linear SC bent to make an O that will cut plugs from metal.
I've got a Camelbak that holds up to 3L of water and probably could fit at least 3 dead babies in there.

[asilentbob]

Yeah exactly, flying molten doughnuts!

[InspiredByMe]

I'm going to make one of these and test it on a concrete wall. I'll use MEKP det cord,the only peroxide I use anymore, and a water bottle.

[asilentbob]

Thats pretty low VoD...

[lordnitrox]

ahh the old PRRT how i missed you, though still not the same : (

anyway, i was thinking of learning how to do some mine blasting..learn how to rig up a good "lift" charge to loosen up dirt and shit for digging a huge fucking hole....thinking it may put to a good use here soon

[InspiredByMe]

Originally Posted by asilentbob

Thats pretty low VoD...

Yeah but it's my first one and sort of a test. I'll use PETN later if I use these instead of reg SCs.

[lordnitrox]

so I was reading some information on PE/chemical horn fuse systems and got an idea. If you were to take the chemical horn idea and put it in a rocket with a PROPERLY BALANCED charge in the upper body you may have a better way to do areal HE dets....not sure how you would get it to work, but if you could build it so the liquid in the horn mixes when the burst charge goes off it may be a cool idea. I don't think i would be brave enough to try it without a lot of testing, but im sure someone here would like to toy with the idea a bit.

[Von Bass]

Hai guyz, long time since I last ventured unto the smokey areas of chemistry.

Acting on a somewhat fortuitously timed urge, I decided to synth a smidgeon of nitrocellulose. All going swimmingly, even using really shitty quality H2SO4 (see picture) and NH4NO3 to make up the nitrating bath, but I now realise I have a slight problem...

Any tips for getting the fucker to detonate once dry & pure? I'm only going to have a very small amount, roughly 3g I reckon, might I have to turn to everyone's least favourite peroxide primary and make caps / mix 70NC:30AP?

That's a rather pointless picture of a sight ye've all seen a hundred times before. I merely happened to have my camera handy.


Cheers for any help, good to see &Z now has BB. Totse is slowly returning.

[13579]

Good to see this place back.

Wasn't sure if this warranted a new topic or not, so thought I should just post here.

Friends birthday is in a few days. Another friend contacted me about an hour ago about giving him a nice present.

We're thinking several AP charges, total amount of A.P. being around half a pound. Around here, AP is basically the only [[Good]] explosive we can get our hands on.

So, at the moment, I'm just reviewing all my safety knowledge (Never know when someone's improved upon old techniques).

Is the generally acceptable method of storage still upside down in a container of water?

Any personal tips/experiences we all haven't already read a few thousand times?

[asilentbob]

Best to not store it... If your going to make a bunch, dry it in separate piles. Don't store too many of them together in one place. Wear lots of protection. Cutting the AP with something else is always an option. If your not hand pressing the salutes, cutting it with something like saw dust may be a good option, should make things very slightly less sensitive. If these are big charges, and not just small salutes, you may want to fuse them only just before use. Or perhaps fire electrically. Be sure that there are no small rocks in the vicinity of the charge. Eye protection very strongly recommended.

Something easier and quite possibly just as satisfying would be flammable gasses in balloons (or a big trash bag!). Propane or acetylene for instance. Or oxygen and acetylene from a welder. You would have to be VERY careful with setting them off though. Maybe attach them to a post and use an e-match... Or better yet, a flaming arrow! Man that sounds so satisfying.

Edit: Theres some vids on youtube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a0Pqm...eature=related

You also get the satisfying easily visible fireball with gases... you don't really get that so much with HEs unless its in really big quantities or slowed down on video.

[InspiredByMe]

Originally Posted by asilentbob

Something easier and quite possibly just as satisfying would be flammable gasses in balloons (or a big trash bag!). Propane or acetylene for instance. Or oxygen and acetylene from a welder. You would have to be VERY careful with setting them off though. Maybe attach them to a post and use an e-match... Or better yet, a flaming arrow! Man that sounds so satisfying.

Acetylene and oxygen is a deadly mix. The noise is insane for a regular gas explosion. Be extremely careful because acetylene has a very wide explosive radius.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HUVNf...om=PL&index=19

[asilentbob]

Heh, yeah I have seen that one a few times before... I wonder what he was thinking when he pulled the sash down... and I can't tell what he is lighting. I'd guess a small balloon.

[13579]

I'm on dialup; loading video now.

At the longest, it'll be stored for 2 days. Separate piles, thinking about pressing methods.

If it's big enough, I'll definitely use an E-match. I usually wear eye protection and a thick carhartt jacket.

This is going to be an interesting Friday.