Meat, Vegetables, or Both?

[Dalaran]

I recently had an interesting conversation with someone on the issue of why they were vegetarian. The argument boiled down to this:

She is not vegetarian because: 1.) She does not believe in causing suffering to sentient life; 2.) She believes that by eating meat, we are causing suffering to sentient life (namely, the animal which we kill to eat); and therefore she does not eat meat.

Of course, our discussion went more in depth and we looked at why we think some of the premises her argument might hold or not hold true. I will save you the details (though provide them upon your request).

What I am interested is two things: first, whether you are vegetarian, vegan, or omnivorous (or possibly are solely carnivorous); second, why you are vegetarian, vegan, or omnivorous; and third, particularly to those who eat meat, on what grounds would you justify causing "suffering to sentient life," when there are alternatives)? Or if you do not believe that eating meat causes "suffering to sentient life" please provide a response as to why you do not believe this premise, or other problems you have with assumptions made in her argument.

Your responses appreciated!

[My Name is The Lord]

Vegetables are for peasants and the ignorant.

[None Other]

What I want to know is what do moral vegetarians feed their carnivores pets. If they see it reprehensible to choose to eat animals then what does it say if they force their pets to eat animals, despite the fact it is what they need to eat... So tell me, what do they do?

[earthbound01]

Originally Posted by None Other

What I want to know is what do moral vegetarians feed their carnivores pets. If they see it reprehensible to choose to eat animals then what does it say if they force their pets to eat animals, despite the fact it is what they need to eat... So tell me, what do they do?

Many don't believe in pets and many don't keep pets that are strictly carnivorous. They justify the killing of animals by other animals as the "wild" and don't have to contribute to any suffering for animals. You can usually find many holes in their thinking if you dig deep enough.

I am a omnivore because animals are too delicious for me to care whether they suffer or not.
*bites into some well-cooked baby cow*

[Lewcifer]

I've got no problem with killing animals for food as it's natural; however rearing animals in an enclosure of any kind (be it field or battery cage) is not natural. The two main reasons I went vegetarian (or vegetablist as my flatmate says ) are concerns over quality of life for the animal and macro-ecological concerns. The first one because I'm a tool when it comes to animals; I can watch a video of Russian conscripts being beheaded without flinching, but the idea of an animal suffering shits me up inside. The second because my old biology teacher scared the shart out of me talking about populations / starvation / future food prices/ land area needed to produce certain foods / trophic levels etc.

I have no grudge against or feeling of moral-superiority over people who eat meat whatsoever; BUT "vegetarians" who eat fish or white meat irritate me more than a chuff-itch. Surely if you're concerned about distress and ecological damage then fish and chicken are the worst things to be eating? I've yet to see a beef cow raised in a battery cage, or a dolphin get caught in pig netting.

[ReclaimPublicSpace]

I'm a vegetarian because I believe that the world is much more sustainable on a meatless diet, in terms of food production and the environment. For ethical and moral reasons, I don't support the meat industry or the way animals are reared and treated in farms and in slaughterhouses. Even buying organic meat doesn't guarantee that your meat wasn't treated like a piece of crap. Plus, the feed that a lot of animals eat while being raised is full of chemical additives and livestock are pumped full of hormones and chemicals to make them stronger, fatter, "healthier", etc. Yet not many people really know what these chemicals do. Look into Monsanto Corporation and the rBGH milk scandal. Even if these animals are not fed genetically enhanced/chemically modified products, sometimes they are forced to eat other types of meat. Like cows eating cows. Or pigs eating pigs. I don't think that's justifiable. Also because a vegetarian lifestyle is usually healthier than someone who eats meat, specifically red meat, which is very high in animal fat. So, three big reasons, in the order they matter most to me:

1. Sustainability/Environmental issues
2. Morality/Ethics
3. Health & Well-being

And that's why I'm a vegetarian.

[KikoSanchez]

Originally Posted by My Name is The Lord

Vegetables are for peasants and the ignorant.

No way, meat is soo for the peasantry, them and their damn mutton pies!!

[KikoSanchez]

Originally Posted by Lewcifer

I've got no problem with killing animals for food as it's natural

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naturalistic_fallacy

[KikoSanchez]

As for me, I'm a vegetarian purely on ethical reasons. I was a vegan for a long time, but I now eat some cheese. Imo, vegetarianism/veganism and even environmentalism are purely less-harm solutions. They are far from least-harm, but they are a step in the right direction, without completely withdrawing from modern society.

[Dalaran]

Supposing, and veggie eaters, I know this is a *BIG* supposing:

There is a way to raise meat in environmentally appropriate ways AND that eating good quality meat of this caliber actually has health benefits.

Is there a way to raise animals in such a way that is respectful (think "free range" etc.) and eat them as well? Or do you think this is a contradiction of terms?

I do not feel strong moral obligations to creatures of the animal kingdom and I have difficulty (some days) understanding why vegetarians and other animal rights activists have such strong compassion for animals. Anyone care to share?